Pure Stage 2...DD vs High Flow?

HERBCHEMIST

New Member
Oct 18, 2017
7
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2010 BMW 335I
I'm upgrading my stock turbos here in a month or so. Going with Pure Stage 2 for sure. Can't decide which one to go with, daily driver (DD) vs. high flow. My objective with this car is to be between 550 - 600 HP. Don't want all of the maintenance that goes with higher HP#'s. Current build detailed below. Which turbo will give me a better lifespan (e.g. turbo reliability)? One might think a turbo built for 600 - 700 HP will last longer because it can easily hit my target vs. the DD that is hitting the max numbers day after day.

Any recommendations?

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Here are the details of my girl: 2010 335i 'vert (E93) | 6AT w/ xHP S3 | Dinan Brand (Cold Air Intake, FMIC, High Capacity Oil Cooler, High Flow Exhaust) | Down***** | BMS FSB Meth w/ CM10 | Evolution Racewerks CP | Synapse Synchronic BOV | RB PCV | BMS OCC | NGK 5992 @ 0.021" | Stock turbos | JB4 G5_ISO_32_8_T11 | Trebila Performance BEF | Custom Koni Racing Suspension | 19" Beyern | Michelin PSS | 50K Mi
 

Bmwfixerguy1

Lieutenant
Jun 5, 2017
873
288
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07 335i MT
DD should do it. I'd make sure you get the 2in extended snouts for sure. Makes inlet installs much much easier!

Also change up o a few smaller nozzles vs the one cm10.. that single cm10 that got popular drives me bonkers I just don't like the idea of it at allllllllllllll
 

cityazndan

Specialist
Jan 17, 2017
94
12
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2009 335i
Explain to me why twin CM7 is better than single CM10, I'm curious to know the reasoning.

Also, OP are you looking for 550-600hp or whp. 600whp on DD is going to be pushing it imo.
 

langsbr

Captain
Apr 5, 2017
1,197
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07 335i 6MT e90
Which ones does Terry have on their car? They just posted a dyno of 615whp @ 25psi on E80. Said it was a mild setup, not pushing anything very hard.
 

langsbr

Captain
Apr 5, 2017
1,197
685
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07 335i 6MT e90
OP are you dead set on Pures? There's been a number of 600whp examples of MMPs as of late. The only thing I don't like about Pure is that they don't list the difference or specs between the DD and high flows. When I purchase something, I want specs - MMP provides those specs. Most in the BMW arena just want a stage or a dyno, but it't totally subjective without proper data.
 

cityazndan

Specialist
Jan 17, 2017
94
12
0
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2009 335i
Supposedly with the right fueling, the DDs are at 60% WGDC at around 600whp....which is impressive. Nonetheless I went with High Flow with 2" ported outlets so hopefully I can get to 650-675whp. Sorry for thread jack OP
 

JAperformance

Specialist
Feb 13, 2017
90
44
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09 335i
definitely High flow, why push the turbo when you can reach your goal and still have room for improvement later. We all say we don't want more while we know we are just lying to ourselves lol..
 

DerFixer

New Member
Jun 12, 2017
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1M
Through my research trying to compare all dyno graphs I've decided on DD's. The pures don't spool particularly quickly compared to the other twins on the market and the high flows on seem to exacerbate the lag. I'm not looking for big numbers, just a significant power upgrade with spool and reliability. It's possible there's better options out there but pure dds are the only reliable option that fit those requirements as of now.
 

hassan_hamdan

Specialist
Aug 1, 2017
74
12
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135i M package
definitely High flow, why push the turbo when you can reach your goal and still have room for improvement later. We all say we don't want more while we know we are just lying to ourselves lol..

Because when the boost bug bites (which in this case 500-600 hp it started to) its just another reason to turn up the boost imo hahaha. But personally I like the idea of having turbos with more head room. The biggest thing you need to remember is how the power comes on. usually higher turbos means more spool time. smaller turbos with smaller max means power typically comes on faster. Up to you at the end of the day on how you want it to drive.
 

zmon1300

Corporal
Nov 3, 2016
181
114
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Chicagoland
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'10 335xi
Get the HiFlow ones, you want the turbo to work as least as possible to hit your goal. DD's are good but they may be at their max at the power you want. Good Luck with your build!
 

SuperVeloceE82

Private
Nov 5, 2016
30
11
0
Socal
Through my research trying to compare all dyno graphs I've decided on DD's. The pures don't spool particularly quickly compared to the other twins on the market and the high flows on seem to exacerbate the lag. I'm not looking for big numbers, just a significant power upgrade with spool and reliability. It's possible there's better options out there but pure dds are the only reliable option that fit those requirements as of now.
Any updates on the stage 2 DD turbos? I ordered a set during the black friday promotion and didnt get the Hiflows because im turning my car into a track/time attack car and dont need more than 500whp. I plan on gutting the car to around 3000 with half tank of gas and no driver. Should put me at a similar power to weight ratio of a c7 z06.

Looking forward to seeing your results
 

cloud9blue

Sergeant
Oct 17, 2017
255
190
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09 E92 335i
Any updates on the stage 2 DD turbos? I ordered a set during the black friday promotion and didnt get the Hiflows because im turning my car into a track/time attack car and dont need more than 500whp. I plan on gutting the car to around 3000 with half tank of gas and no driver. Should put me at a similar power to weight ratio of a c7 z06.

Looking forward to seeing your results

i dunno about using a stock frame twin for track use. wastegates on these cars wear out fast at the temp. you see on race tracks.
 

SuperVeloceE82

Private
Nov 5, 2016
30
11
0
Socal
i dunno about using a stock frame twin for track use. wastegates on these cars wear out fast at the temp. you see on race tracks.


Although i do agree, i got roughly 30 track days on the stock turbos without any issues. With proper cooling and adding hood vents to decrease engine bay temps i think ill be okay. For now im just doing track days, once im ready to go full blown time attack im going with a motiv single
 

cloud9blue

Sergeant
Oct 17, 2017
255
190
0
Ride
09 E92 335i
Although i do agree, i got roughly 30 track days on the stock turbos without any issues. With proper cooling and adding hood vents to decrease engine bay temps i think ill be okay. For now im just doing track days, once im ready to go full blown time attack im going with a motiv single

hood vents is not going to lower your EGT. even e85 will not save your wastegate bushings. the only way to save your stock frame wastegate is to get rid of the stock boost control and run turbine housing that isn't as undersized as the stock one.
 

SuperVeloceE82

Private
Nov 5, 2016
30
11
0
Socal
hood vents is not going to lower your EGT. even e85 will not save your wastegate bushings. the only way to save your stock frame wastegate is to get rid of the stock boost control and run turbine housing that isn't as undersized as the stock one.


Not planning to run high boost. 500whp map would be for roll racing events like shift sector and mexico. On track i plan on having a tune by Motiv that is designed to have the car running at optimal temperatures and last a 15-20 session. Not getting these turbos because i want to run them at a max level and see what they make. I plan on making 400-420whp on the track tune at best (you dont need power to run fast laps). EGT will be hot regardless, but with the help of BCP Colossal fmic and dual comp oil coolers along with a good flowing 3.5 inch exhaust and other cooling solutions i will do what i can to minimize the heat overall. And like i said, for now car will be used for weekend fun and HPDE events once im at a level to compete i will be going single.


I got around 30 track days out of the stock turbos at 20-22psi, so running these at around 16-18ish psi shouldnt result in damaged wastegates or wastegate bushings.
 

cloud9blue

Sergeant
Oct 17, 2017
255
190
0
Ride
09 E92 335i
Not planning to run high boost. 500whp map would be for roll racing events like shift sector and mexico. On track i plan on having a tune by Motiv that is designed to have the car running at optimal temperatures and last a 15-20 session. Not getting these turbos because i want to run them at a max level and see what they make. I plan on making 400-420whp on the track tune at best (you dont need power to run fast laps). EGT will be hot regardless, but with the help of BCP Colossal fmic and dual comp oil coolers along with a good flowing 3.5 inch exhaust and other cooling solutions i will do what i can to minimize the heat overall. And like i said, for now car will be used for weekend fun and HPDE events once im at a level to compete i will be going single.


I got around 30 track days out of the stock turbos at 20-22psi, so running these at around 16-18ish psi shouldnt result in damaged wastegates or wastegate bushings.

the only things that affects egt at your turbo is your timing, afr, and manifold/turbine housing. none of the other cooling mod will matter.

sure they will last a while just like the stockers, but i personally would hate to spend $2-3k plus install just to have them rattling again. I am just speaking from my experience with tracking my car for the last few years. it just make more sense to just to stay stock until you are ready to go single for your application.
 

SuperVeloceE82

Private
Nov 5, 2016
30
11
0
Socal
the only things that affects egt at your turbo is your timing, afr, and manifold/turbine housing. none of the other cooling mod will matter.

sure they will last a while just like the stockers, but i personally would hate to spend $2-3k plus install just to have them rattling again. I am just speaking from my experience with tracking my car for the last few years. it just make more sense to just to stay stock until you are ready to go single for your application.


I get where your coming from and appreciate the info. Ive talked to Jake at motiv and we will do what we can to get the car dialed in as best as we can for track reliability. The only single kit i would get is the motiv and i dont have the funds to spend that much yet but one day will. So for time being even if the pure last me 2 years ill be more than happy with them. I do about 1-2 track days a month. And i dont track during the summer months.


Any links to your build would love to see what been done and what it looks like? Cant see you location but what tracks have you taken your car to? Being in Socal ive only been to the local ones: Big willow, streets of willow, Autoclub speedway and Buttonwillow (my favorite by far)