No Start - No Crank - No Click

NoQuarter

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So I replaced my starter.... See my post below on the carnage I created cutting the starter out!

That Fekken Starter Bolt!

I still have the exact same symptoms and they are described perfectly in this conversation on E90Post E90 Starter Discussion.

The beginning:
- Never any hints of a starter problem. No weak cranks, etc
- Without warning, car does not attempt to crank. No clicks, etc and everything works as expected with strong blower fan, lights, etc
- Attempt to jump start, no clicks, no crank, etc
- Have it towed home
- Attempt to turn starter with Bump starter trigger - nothing
- Check for power at the cable. Power checks out so I replaced the starter

** when I checked for power I only used a test LED and I checked between the strut tower for ground and the starter power cable. So It could be weak power I suppose
Current Situation:
- New starter is in. Exact same behavior
- Tried my second key. Exact same behavior
- Currently just waiting to end work today and spend some time on it. My first check will be the Ground and voltage difference between engine block and chassis ground.
 
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Rob09msport

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I would maybe try taking jumper cables from your jump post to the starter and from block to chassis then see if starts and also check solenoid
 

Rob09msport

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Not sure if you checked for power while cranking or just to see if main line was bringing juice in. I believe it is a relay setup where the power is constant so that the ignition doesnt have to handle all that current but if it was a weak connection i would expect that you would get clicking, so i would think that the solenoid isn't triggering the starter
 

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Only thing that comes to mind on a whim is the chassis ground strap to the engine block. IIRC its connected to the driver side engine support arm and goes over to the frame rail under the steering column. Check to see if that is loose or frayed or something. Even if that is disconnected you will still see voltage at the starter from the grounds of engine wire harness but those small awg grounds are not enough to provide proper amperage to get the starter to run. (hence the need for large chassis to block ground strap)

Hope that is it and hope that helps!
Cheers,
Barry
 

buster84

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Did you ever get your positive battery cable replaced?

This was a known problem when the cables were malfunctioning. If the cable is bad or the explosive inside the cable went off on it's own the car will get power but your starter won't to prevent the car from turning over. This is just another thing to check.
 
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NoQuarter

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Thanks everyone for the tips.

Voltage between Jump post and strut tower 12.5V
Voltage between jump post and engine block/starter body 12.4V
Voltage at solenoid wire when the start button is depressed is 11.8V

I jumpered a wire between the solenoid and the jump post and got nothing, not even a click - same as with the original starter.

So... either this new starter has the exact same problem with the solenoid or ???

To check the power cable at the starter I will need to get the intake off again but if the solenoid isn't even clicking then it doesn't matter what power the main cable has.

Be right back.... gonna give this new starter a good whack!

I suppose next step is to remove the intake again and put some power directly on the starter.
 

buster84

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Have you checked all your fuses/relays? That would be the next step, Maybe a fuse recently blew or its a relay. I doubt your new starters is bad.

Also I dont think you can jump the car with just bypassing the power. The starter needs to energize which requires the correct CAS key code, ECU, Transmission is Park and the foot pedal pressed. Without doing all 4 it won't work otherwise you just figured out how to steal a bmw lol.
 

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fmorelli

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Since both starters exhibited the same problem I might take the one on the bench, put 12V to the starter main (jumper cable to your battery), run the GND somewhere, and then alligator clip GND on the solenoid, then touch the solenoid with a positively powered alligator. See what happens. It should do nothing (we assumed it was bad, right?) ... then I'd move to the starter in the car based on what I learned from the bench test, accordingly. It is possible that the new starter has a bad solenoid.

Sorry you're having these problems. I went through a starter nightmare on the E36 318ti M-technic about four months ago. I was all EWS hinky but it turned out to be something else.

Filippo

p.s. I buy starters and alternators from FCP Euro ... given lifetime warranty. I lost an alternator 18 months after install and they replaced no questions asked.
 

NoQuarter

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Have you checked all your fuses/relays? That would be the next step, Maybe a fuse recently blew or its a relay. I doubt your new starters is bad.

Also I dont think you can jump the car with just bypassing the power. The starter needs to energize which requires the correct CAS key code, ECU, Transmission is Park and the foot pedal pressed. Without doing all 4 it won't work otherwise you just figured out how to steal a bmw lol.

This is mostly true. But bypassing all of that and just energizing the starter directly will cause the starter motor to turn the engine over. Car engine won't start of course but it will crank over.
 

The Convert

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This is mostly true. But bypassing all of that and just energizing the starter directly will cause the starter motor to turn the engine over. Car engine won't start of course but it will crank over.
But then you would know it's not the starter.
 
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aus335iguy

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I have heard of faulty starter buttons but the fact you’re getting voltage to the solenoid when pressing means it won’t be that
 

NoQuarter

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What I think is going on is a grounding problem. We have a good enough ground to measure all the right voltages but not enough to energize the starter.

- Putting a jumper cable from the ground point on the strut tower to the engine block does NOT work either.
- Running the jumper cable from the negative side of the battery in the trunk to strut tower bolts does NOT work.
- Running the jumper cable from the negative side of the battery in the trunk to the engine block DOES work.

I have new starter, no regrets replacing a 10-11 year old starter
I have a new battery, no regrets replacing an almost 8 year old battery

So Barry's description seems spot on at the moment. But... while I was under the car trying to remove the starter from above the transmission, I looked at the ground strap and it seemed OK. So back under the car I go.

20180706_161650.jpg
 

The Convert

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You take your throttle body off the manifold for removal? Crazy. I just leave it on. I also cut the screws down on the wiring box under the intake so they only require about 1 turn to remove now. So, really quick removal.
 

NoQuarter

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You take your throttle body off the manifold for removal? Crazy. I just leave it on. I also cut the screws down on the wiring box under the intake so they only require about 1 turn to remove now. So, really quick removal.

Those 4 bolts for the throttle body are pretty easy to remove. I hate trying to fit that intake back on so much the thought of having that hanging off of it didn't seem too appealing. Next time I will try it your way.
 

The Convert

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Those 4 bolts for the throttle body are pretty easy to remove. I hate trying to fit that intake back on so much the thought of having that hanging off of it didn't seem too appealing. Next time I will try it your way.
Hahaha...you do have a lot more of the stock parts than I do. So, tb off may be better.