Possible boost leak or just being daft ?

[Subwoofer]

Hello all, Running stage 2 + MHD with the Evolve DP + Intercooler.

Looks like the boost isnt hitting the target towards the end, do you think my wastegates are causing havoc ? Recently they have been making a very big rattle....

Click me for the datalog

Let me know, everything else looks fine.

 

[tony@codewerx]

Stock turbos ?

if so - it’s about there

 

[Subwoofer]

Stock turbos ?

if so - it’s about there

Yeah stock still, okay sweet. that's great. Just making sure there aren't any problems, I'm having BMW take a look at my car on Wednesday to hopefully goodwill my wastegate rattle

 

[Slowagon54]

Which Octane Map are you running on Stage 2+? Looks like low Octane, just curious.

 

[Subwoofer]

Which Octane Map are you running on Stage 2+? Looks like low Octane, just curious.

So I'm running 91 OCTANE map even though I only put Tesco Momentum (99 RON) i believe or shell v power which is also 99. So maybe I should change the map to 98 ron map ?

 

[Slowagon54]

Turn it up. No timing corrections on the posted log. Flash the next Map with more octane and run a log. Shell V Power is a good choice.

 

[Subwoofer]

Turn it up. No timing corrections on the posted log. Flash the next Map with more octane and run a log. Shell V Power is a good choice.

Turned it up, did two logs first looks great, and then second is completely strange the boost is off target like crazy.

Click me for first log (great)

Click me for second log (boost off)

I’ll go and do another one now...

 

[Slowagon54]

Good thing is, there are no correction with added timing. Which is very good. Strange thing is, the boost is off somehow. How old are the turbos? Is there an aftermarket bov? If yes, which spring are you using?

 

[ajm8127]

In the first log you are adding 15.5% with PID until 5743 RPM then it drops to the same as "WGDC Base Value". As soon as this happens your actual boost dips below target by about 3 psi. In the second log your "WGDC Base Value" and "WGDC After PID" are the same value and boost again is around 3 psi short of target.

I am still rocking an AccessPort from like 2013 and don't have MHD, but that wouldn't be normal on a log from my car.

 

[ShocknAwe]

Interesting that your duty cycle doesn't hit hard up front to spool up the turbos. Can you do another log with bank1 and bank 2 WGDC. But you're at like 75% either way. For example: mine ran at lower duty cycle (40?) to spool to the same boost target when my car was FBO.

 

[Subwoofer]

Good thing is, there are no correction with added timing. Which is very good. Strange thing is, the boost is off somehow. How old are the turbos? Is there an aftermarket bov? If yes, which spring are you using?

Hello, the turbos are still stock from 2007 with 58000 miles on the clock currently. No blow off valve either.

In the first log you are adding 15.5% with PID until 5743 RPM then it drops to the same as "WGDC Base Value". As soon as this happens your actual boost dips below target by about 3 psi. In the second log your "WGDC Base Value" and "WGDC After PID" are the same value and boost again is around 3 psi short of target.

I am still rocking an AccessPort from like 2013 and don't have MHD, but that wouldn't be normal on a log from my car.

Well that’s what I’m worried about because it does seem odd, but could also be because of the wastegate rattle fix...

Interesting that your duty cycle doesn't hit hard up front to spool up the turbos. Can you do another log with bank1 and bank 2 WGDC. But you're at like 75% either way. For example: mine ran at lower duty cycle (40?) to spool to the same boost target when my car was FBO.

I have the wastegate rattle fix on 5% (lowest possible value) because at anything above it’s obnoxious. The vacuum test was done on wastegates and they don’t seal at all... so maybe that ?

 

[carabuser]

WGDC looks very high to me but only as revs climb so could be a boost leak or maybe just old turbos.

Have you done a visual around the charge pipework looking for blow-by leaks?

 

[Subwoofer]

WGDC looks very high to me but only as revs climb so could be a boost leak or maybe just old turbos.

Have you done a visual around the charge pipework looking for blow-by leaks?

But could that be due to the fact I have wastegate rattle fully on ?
Doesn’t seem to be any blow by

 

[carabuser]

The rattle reduction slider just changes behaviour when off boost I think. When on boost it won't make a difference.

 

[ajm8127]

Just turn off the rattle fix to see if there is any difference. It shouldn't be necessary at all.

I would be concerned why PID all of a sudden goes to 0. As @ShocknAwe noted there is no spool mode in the second log. It's like PID gives up.

So you applied 5.9 in Hg vacuum to the actuators and the waste gates were not sealing? On both turbos?

 

[Subwoofer]

The rattle reduction slider just changes behaviour when off boost I think. When on boost it won't make a difference.

Well that’s what I suspected... hmm

Just turn off the rattle fix to see if there is any difference. It shouldn't be necessary at all.

I would be concerned why PID all of a sudden goes to 0. As @ShocknAwe noted there is no spool mode in the second log. It's like PID gives up.

So you applied 5.9 in Hg vacuum to the actuators and the waste gates were not sealing? On both turbos?

It was taken into BMW (was trying to get a warranty repair for turbo) the guy said that the waste gates aren’t sealing properly/working. I was planning on doing a 17T turbo

 

[carabuser]

Do you have the proper Mondial BMW warranty? They should replace turbos with that one if you are forceful enough. I had both mine replaced at 50k miles with only minor rattle. Wastegates not sealing will cause what you're seeing in logs.

New turbos can still rattle a little though, just luck of the draw I think.

 

[RSL]

When PID stops and it just runs on base DC, there should be a 3100 code and probably at least one other code that caused the disable. The cause could have nothing to do with the turbos at all, vanos and others will disable boost control.

Once 3100 is set, need to restart the car to get control working again, which is why there is none on the second log.

If the second code is related to boost, like 30FF, could just be a tune issue, but a hardware problem (boost leak, etc) is always a possibility.

 

[Subwoofer]

When PID stops and it just runs on base DC, there should be a 3100 code and probably at least one other code that caused the disable. The cause could have nothing to do with the turbos at all, vanos and others will disable boost control.

Once 3100 is set, need to restart the car to get control working again, which is why there is none on the second log.

If the second code is related to boost, like 30FF, could just be a tune issue, but a hardware problem (boost leak, etc) is always a possibility.

So I checked DTC codes and I had a 30FF (shadow) do we think that’s because my wastegates are buggered ?

 

[RSL]

As far as 30FF, actual isn't close enough to target for too long and the DME stops trying. Why actual isn't close enough to target can be because target is just too high to reach for the WGDC, boost is low for the WGDC or some combo of both.

If it's low boost for WGDC, could be any number of causes: low atmospheric pressure (yours isn't), boost leak, WGs, solenoids, vacuum leak to the solenoids/WGs, bad solenoids, etc.

There's only so much stock turbos can do over 5500-6000rpm even when everything is working perfectly, but WGDC seems like it might be high regardless. I'd find other logs to compare with to verify, I dont keep up with them much.

I'd personally check for boost leaks and any vacuum leaks first and foremost, but WGs are certainly a possibility. It's just not something you can diagnose over the internet though, there are many potentials and you'll have to start ruling them out. Not sure how much more you'd get out of them up top either way, but never hurts to make sure there are no leaks.