??PI with cooling??

Bmwfixerguy1

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Jun 5, 2017
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For you guys that run PI, I know I've had a lot of questions and ideas lately lol..

Has anyone ever branched off the rail and added a small meth nozzle like a 100cc say down low in the CP or off the IC outlet for cooling? I feel like when we have something totally great and kinda a solution to all are engines problems or Holy grailish like PI has become we kinda lose sight as enthusiasts on how we could maybe make it a tad better.
For example.. Were all happy as hell with a sandwich plate when in reality that's a huge compromise on how we would want it to be.

I know I know.. Why would you do that you have PI.. Well because I've never heard anyone say "man if I can just get my intake air temps a little higher I'll be right where I wanna be" and because racekar of course!
 

doublespaces

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Oct 18, 2016
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Yeah, there have been all sorts of meth setups. I suggested staggered injection several years ago and someone actually took it upon themselves to try pre-turbo injection. I think I've heard of as many as four or five nozzles scattered throughout the intake tract.
 

Bmwfixerguy1

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Jun 5, 2017
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Yeah, there have been all sorts of meth setups. I suggested staggered injection several years ago and someone actually took it upon themselves to try pre-turbo injection. I think I've heard of as many as four or five nozzles scattered throughout the intake tract.

Sorry I may have not been clear.. I mean with E85
 

Bmwfixerguy1

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Jun 5, 2017
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Ah. I'm not sure if someone has done that, but basically its TBI but mounted further upstream. I bet @[email protected] could tell you about that placement in regards to cooling effects.

I know the initial answer is going to be its not needed from all the cooling effects of E85 and PI.. I say bull lol.. No one ever wanted a warmer charge! Well actually that get kinda tricky with atomization effects and stuff like that but generally speaking cold cold cold
 
Oct 24, 2016
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As far as reducing air temps, E85 isn't going to cool very well.

TBI drops charge temps slightly but nothing like an actual water/meth setup (it's the alcohol that does most of the temp change... the water does it's magic once in-cylinder).

IIRC we saw something like a 10* change... but don't quote me on that. It was small enough that we were like "meh".

Chris
 

Bmwfixerguy1

Lieutenant
Jun 5, 2017
873
289
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07 335i MT
As far as reducing air temps, E85 isn't going to cool very well.

TBI drops charge temps slightly but nothing like an actual water/meth setup (it's the alcohol that does most of the temp change... the water does it's magic once in-cylinder).

IIRC we saw something like a 10* change... but don't quote me on that. It was small enough that we were like "meh".

Chris

Good answer.. Meh is one of the most universal understandings of NOPE lol.

I would also think relying off fuel pump pressure as well you may not get the atomization needed to really work as designed.. 70psi vs 150+psi
 
Oct 24, 2016
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Yep, you hit the nail on the head there, and a major issue with many of the current water/meth kits; incomplete atomization is a bigger deal than people give room for. This shows up as uneven fuel distribution/etc. etc. All I'll say is that current designs leave some room for improvement.

Unfortunately, chemically speaking ethanol won't pull as much heat out of the air. Methanol is hard to beat, which is why it's been used for nearly 70 years.

There are some VERY good websites that talk about this in depth, and in fact some of those guys are using 1000 psi pumps to ensure things get atomized properly. They do well for themselves. ;)
 
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