B58 WHP output with 98RON fuel

gachdavit

Private
Mar 25, 2022
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N54s got a major internal remodel after January of 2009. 6 bolt crank and better cams but a worse block for power
Based on your comment about N54 engine remodel,

What will be a better choice ?

Buy N54 manufactured in 2008 ? Or buy N54 manufactured in 2012 {335IS} (With DCT) ?

Because they improved one thing, but unimproved another thing.

Thanks !
 

RuskiRacer

Captain
Jul 17, 2019
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2009 e93 335i
Based on your comment about N54 engine remodel,

What will be a better choice ?

Buy N54 manufactured in 2008 ? Or buy N54 manufactured in 2012 {335IS} (With DCT) ?

Because they improved one thing, but unimproved another thing.

Thanks !
Well bmw did the best update to the b58 by eliminating the issue of crankhubs spinning and closing the deck . If you could put a dct behind a behind a b58 that would be ideal for the street in my opinion.
 

gachdavit

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Mar 25, 2022
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Well bmw did the best update to the b58 by eliminating the issue of crankhubs spinning and closing the deck . If you could put a dct behind a behind a b58 that would be ideal for the street in my opinion.
Got it sir,

Really hard to make decision.

Also, B58 has a different versions right ?

I often meet those terms:

B58 gen 1 and B58 gen 2 ?

What is B58TU ? I do not see B58TU on wikipedia as a version of B58.

Versions:

B58B30M0
B58B30M1
B58B30C
B58B30O1

Which is TU above ?

Gen 2 is only in supra ?

Also, if i choose B58 which year B58 will be the best and which chassis ?

M140i/M240i/M340i and Which years B58 is the most powerful ? Anyone has information about it ?

Thanks again !
 

RuskiRacer

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Jul 17, 2019
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What models with a b58 are available in your country? In America we only got 340 240 and 440 and the supra as well
 

gachdavit

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Mar 25, 2022
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What models with a b58 are available in your country? In America we only got 340 240 and 440 and the supra as well
In my country, there are not so much B58.

I must buy car from USA.

I want to do my best and choose correct B58 version or N54 version (This is second scenario).

Thanks !
 

RuskiRacer

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Jul 17, 2019
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240i and 340i and the supra are all good b58 options id avoid buying the first 2 years of the 240i and 340i. The 335is with the dct is a really fun rwd car as well
 

rac

Sergeant
Nov 14, 2016
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Well on an N54 with a 6466 700whp dynojet has been made with 93 + DP meth. It is possible but you will be relying on a lot of meth for fuel. You will want a rock solid meth set up.

yeah but at the start he said "with just 98RON fuel", hence my negative spin on ambitions.
 
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gachdavit

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Mar 25, 2022
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yeah but at the start he said "with just 98RON fuel", hence my negative spin on ambitions.
Yes,

Just I am interested in what is max on 98RON. I am reading a little bit about tune and I know high octane fuel is the key.

Just i want, not to have a wrong expectations.

Thanks !
 

rac

Sergeant
Nov 14, 2016
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Yes,

Just I am interested in what is max on 98RON. I am reading a little bit about tune and I know high octane fuel is the key.

Just i want, not to have a wrong expectations.

Thanks !

Firstly when you are octane limited small things in fuel quality make big differences in what is possible. Also the way fuel is measured is not 100% transferable to the way fuel is used (the machine used to determine RON/AKI etc., is not running direct injection at 3000rpm).

If your local fuel has no ethanol content in it but has the same octane rating as fuel in the US and that fuel contains up to 10% ethanol, you will not get the same results because the direct injection leverages more of the alcohol's benefits than CFR engine (octane rating engine). there are papers written on this.

If your going to buy a car and just put a tune on it, flash or piggyback with no other mods, there are lots of internet posts of dynos for 91/93 AKI fuel from US based users and vendors on dynojets. dynojets are optimistic but they are reasonably repeatable / comparable so there is a huge data set out there for comparison. pick a vendor that sells tunes for both for a fair comparison. i dont know the numbers of the top of my head but i expect < 400whp in both cases. i could not get anywhere near 400whp on 98ron on a bone stock 54 for what its worth.

at the other end of the spectrum if your determined that you want maximum possible hp on cr8p fuel then you need to crunch the numbers on all the upgrades that improves engine airflow at high rpm, i.e. big turbos, head work, cams. i'm guessing the n54 would be cheaper in this regard because its an older platform with more options commonly available for high rpm improvement. so if i were this way inclined and budget limited i would go for a n54.

there are so many other variables to your decision outside of hp relating to the car that the engine is in, dont get distracted by one particular topic. i've procrastinated enough today so last post on topic...
 

RuskiRacer

Captain
Jul 17, 2019
1,132
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Firstly when you are octane limited small things in fuel quality make big differences in what is possible. Also the way fuel is measured is not 100% transferable to the way fuel is used (the machine used to determine RON/AKI etc., is not running direct injection at 3000rpm).

If your local fuel has no ethanol content in it but has the same octane rating as fuel in the US and that fuel contains up to 10% ethanol, you will not get the same results because the direct injection leverages more of the alcohol's benefits than CFR engine (octane rating engine). there are papers written on this.

If your going to buy a car and just put a tune on it, flash or piggyback with no other mods, there are lots of internet posts of dynos for 91/93 AKI fuel from US based users and vendors on dynojets. dynojets are optimistic but they are reasonably repeatable / comparable so there is a huge data set out there for comparison. pick a vendor that sells tunes for both for a fair comparison. i dont know the numbers of the top of my head but i expect < 400whp in both cases. i could not get anywhere near 400whp on 98ron on a bone stock 54 for what its worth.

at the other end of the spectrum if your determined that you want maximum possible hp on cr8p fuel then you need to crunch the numbers on all the upgrades that improves engine airflow at high rpm, i.e. big turbos, head work, cams. i'm guessing the n54 would be cheaper in this regard because its an older platform with more options commonly available for high rpm improvement. so if i were this way inclined and budget limited i would go for a n54.

there are so many other variables to your decision outside of hp relating to the car that the engine is in, dont get distracted by one particular topic. i've procrastinated enough today so last post on topic...
Well said. Limited by octane having a lower compression ratio makes the engine more tunable to a higher hp without running into know as quickly
 

gachdavit

Private
Mar 25, 2022
31
4
0
Firstly when you are octane limited small things in fuel quality make big differences in what is possible. Also the way fuel is measured is not 100% transferable to the way fuel is used (the machine used to determine RON/AKI etc., is not running direct injection at 3000rpm).

If your local fuel has no ethanol content in it but has the same octane rating as fuel in the US and that fuel contains up to 10% ethanol, you will not get the same results because the direct injection leverages more of the alcohol's benefits than CFR engine (octane rating engine). there are papers written on this.

If your going to buy a car and just put a tune on it, flash or piggyback with no other mods, there are lots of internet posts of dynos for 91/93 AKI fuel from US based users and vendors on dynojets. dynojets are optimistic but they are reasonably repeatable / comparable so there is a huge data set out there for comparison. pick a vendor that sells tunes for both for a fair comparison. i dont know the numbers of the top of my head but i expect < 400whp in both cases. i could not get anywhere near 400whp on 98ron on a bone stock 54 for what its worth.

at the other end of the spectrum if your determined that you want maximum possible hp on cr8p fuel then you need to crunch the numbers on all the upgrades that improves engine airflow at high rpm, i.e. big turbos, head work, cams. i'm guessing the n54 would be cheaper in this regard because its an older platform with more options commonly available for high rpm improvement. so if i were this way inclined and budget limited i would go for a n54.

there are so many other variables to your decision outside of hp relating to the car that the engine is in, dont get distracted by one particular topic. i've procrastinated enough today so last post on topic...
Thanks sir.

It means, I must understand more detail info about fuel in my country.
 

Torgus

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Nov 6, 2016
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@gachdavit How much do you plan on investing in this project?

I ask as making the power is one thing, being able to put it down is another.
 

gachdavit

Private
Mar 25, 2022
31
4
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@gachdavit How much do you plan on investing in this project?

I ask as making the power is one thing, being able to put it down is another.
Once I buy a car,

I want to make things step by step (Because, `B58TU` as I see performs very well even on Stock Turbo / Stock fuel system).

I have already paid 4000$ for parts for my {N55 PWG}, but no result.

I do not want to waste money like this again.

If I get B58, in the sum I will upgrade all {including turbo}. But I want to start with small, and increase power step by step (Also, I am not experienced and learn more things).

But to choose a correct platform first,is important, right ?

Thanks !