This new EKP for our cars looks interesting.

[Dumaurier7]

ET3 is a happy medium, if you really are hung up on primary PWM control - I am not.

I was of the impression that the relay/s would be PWM control capable! having a pair of 535's running at full tilt constantly may be problematic for our (or any other return less) fuel system, there is a reason why BMW decided to design the system as they did. Off the top of my head, I can think of ruptured fuel lines and excessive heating of the fuel system and ridiculous amounts of detonation.

 

[Dumaurier7]

Because I want to maintain the OEM design functionality I just purchased the ET3 , will report back when it’s in hand.

 

[Dumaurier7]

So I purchased the stage 4 ET3 EKP so that I can run a second pump in the tank if required, because of the ( dumb ass) location of our pump access cover getting the power wires through leak free would be a challenge. I’ve been looking around and this is what I am settling with so far.;
A hermetically sealed fuel pump wiring pass through connector from Fuel Lab that I would also use some high strength Loctite epoxy on for additional reassurance.if anyone has done this already feel free to post and lemmie no what u guys think about my plan.

 

[rev210]

I was of the impression that the relay/s would be PWM control capable! having a pair of 535's running at full tilt constantly may be problematic for our (or any other return less) fuel system, there is a reason why BMW decided to design the system as they did. Off the top of my head, I can think of ruptured fuel lines and excessive heating of the fuel system and ridiculous amounts of detonation.

None of that is an issue.
It takes a very long time to heat up the fuel on even two pumps, subject to things like ambient temps and volume of fuel in the tank. Though taking into account the type of purpose for the car is also key.

You don't have both pumps at full tilt till the programmable switch over point, when you 'need' them both on.
You are going to be at 100% duty on both pumps PWM or relay when beating on the car with big power. You want headroom in the full throttle not efficient conservation. Headroom safety over ecconomy. So that it moot.

If your concerns are fuel lines ( they should be regardless of pwm/relay) it's a good idea to upgrade them ( from stock). In fact you absolutely should. I have all braided higher rated and larger lines with rising rate FPR and an actual fuel return line (not return-less). You need /want control of the fuel pressure level with upgraded pumps.

That said the setup you have is going to work great. Do consider the fuel line upgrade and FPR as part of your plan too.

 

[Dumaurier7]

None of that is an issue.
It takes a very long time to heat up the fuel on even two pumps, subject to things like ambient temps and volume of fuel in the tank. Though taking into account the type of purpose for the car is also key.

I had a car (FD3S RX7) once that suffered from low unstable fuel pressure because the pumps were heating the fuel soo much soo quickly that it only ran for very short periods, this issue was resolved by installing a fuel cooler and staging the fuel punps!

You don't have both pumps at full tilt till the programmable switch over point, when you 'need' them both on.
You are going to be at 100% duty on both pumps PWM or relay when beating on the car with big power. You want headroom in the full throttle not efficient conservation. Headroom safety over ecconomy. So that it moot.

If your concerns are fuel lines ( they should be regardless of pwm/relay) it's a good idea to upgrade them ( from stock). In fact you absolutely should. I have all braided higher rated and larger lines with rising rate FPR and an actual fuel return line (not return-less). You need /want control of the fuel pressure level with upgraded pumps.

That said the setup you have is going to work great. Do consider the fuel line upgrade and FPR as part of your plan too.

You seem a bit defensive?? I am not challenging nor criticizing your decision here, I am just stating that the OEM made some design choices which were made for a reason/s which actually work more than not, when modifying the system to support higher power levels I see no reason to change how the system works which I why I choose to not reinvent the operating philosophy, I hope your choices work for you and your build is successful.

 

[rev210]

I had a car (FD3S RX7) once that suffered from low unstable fuel pressure because the pumps were heating the fuel soo much soo quickly that it only ran for very short periods, this issue was resolved by installing a fuel cooler and staging the fuel punps!

You seem a bit defensive?? I am not challenging nor criticizing your decision here, I am just stating that the OEM made some design choices which were made for a reason/s which actually work more than not, when modifying the system to support higher power levels I see no reason to change how the system works which I why I choose to not reinvent the operating philosophy, I hope your choices work for you and your build is successful.

Hey not being defensive personally at all but, perhaps for the topic and specific solution. I am merely correcting some things I think arent quite accurate or at least want to allow some space to gather real data from users like me.
In the interest of keeping things more factual and less speculative about the Speedsty solution specifically in this thread ,for the benefit of those who may consider it. The thread stays on topic as much as we can for the Speedsty. Granted that fuel temp concerns aren't without cause.

Ask is that we can leave some space for debate as we get real world data on its performance and any actual issues that might arise ,including logs for pressure and fuel temps (MHD has a setting to log). I plan to contribute there.
The Speedsty is staged for the secondary pump and it has a variety of programmable options for how/when that happens for a second pump.
I did mention that PWM is a beneficial option for more money and slightly more setup on the ET3 and represents an upgrade choice.
As you and others install the ET3 , it would be great to have a dedicated thread for that solution too

 

[odesh]

This seems interesting to dual pump users. No hop switches required etc. Just from single pump users point of view: Why don't people run solid state relay that is controlled with original EKP PWM and the power to fuel pump comes from battery? Is there a reason not to do that? Seems a lot more cost effective. Obviously not as plug and play but I can't think another reason not to do that.

 

[Dumaurier7]

Hey not being defensive personally at all but, perhaps for the topic and specific solution. I am merely correcting some things I think arent quite accurate or at least want to allow some space to gather real data from users like me.
In the interest of keeping things more factual and less speculative about the Speedsty solution specifically in this thread ,for the benefit of those who may consider it. The thread stays on topic as much as we can for the Speedsty. Granted that fuel temp concerns aren't without cause.

Ask is that we can leave some space for debate as we get real world data on its performance and any actual issues that might arise ,including logs for pressure and fuel temps (MHD has a setting to log). I plan to contribute there.
The Speedsty is staged for the secondary pump and it has a variety of programmable options for how/when that happens for a second pump.
I did mention that PWM is a beneficial option for more money and slightly more setup on the ET3 and represents an upgrade choice.
As you and others install the ET3 , it would be great to have a dedicated thread for that solution too

 

[Dumaurier7]

Everything you have said is not supported by fact or data,, you are expressing your partially to a product without any evidence of its performance, the rest of us are trying to make a decision based on what we know which is the OEM!

 

[wheela]

Please pardon the long-winded response, but regarding the earlier statement about our factory system being return less, and not wanting to blow up fuel lines running two 535's full-tilt without a return line -

Traditional injector systems (non-high pressure) with the fpr up at the rail have the long return line to the tank because the fpr is up at the rail. In this set up, the injectors are between the fuel pump and the regulator - when desired fuel pressure is met, the regulator opens to bypass fuel back to the tank to keep pressure at the injector inlets on target.

I'm not too familiar with our low pressure system (because I haven't had to upgrade mine yet). But because our low pressure fpr is mounted on top of the tank, I'd assume there is still the function of a "return", but there is no need for a physical return from the front of the car because our fpr is mounted to the tank so it can just dump the fuel bypass directly back to the tank without need for a seperate "return line", no? If that's the case, we aren't really "returnless" from a functional standpoint, we just don't have a long return line from the front of the car, our return dumps directly back to the tank.

Is the concern more that our low fuel pressure regulators can't bypass two pumps worth of fuel at low load/idle? That would cause fuel pressure to spike, are n54 guys seeing low pressure fuel pressure spiking with dual pumps and no hobbs or other pump control (n55 doesn't have a low pressure fuel sensor)?

Thoughts on this? Am I misunderstanding how our in-tank low fuel pressure fuel regulators work?

 

[fmorelli]

All these systems have a return. In the N54 setup the return is built within the HPFP itself, and does not go back to the tank.

 

[Dumaurier7]

I have a BPM4 controlling a pair of 435’s on my F22, as we know the BPM4 is controlled by the DME and both pumps are run simultaneously, I saw pressures over 100 psi in the low pressure system at high load and nothing under 70psi llow load so it’s safe to assume that one 535 running at max will overload the system during low load conditions.
I agree that the entire system needs to be re-engineered to include an external high flow FPR but some of us don’t want to go that far especially in the E89 where the tank access cover is vertical and located at the side of the tank just above the exhaust!

 

[rev210]

Everything you have said is not supported by fact or data,, you are expressing your partially to a product without any evidence of its performance, the rest of us are trying to make a decision based on what we know which is the OEM!

The people on a thread about the Speedsty EKP (like the thread starter) are probably interested in real world testing and feedback, facts/data as you like to put it, on the Speedsty EKP.

I've taken the time to post install pics and tips and report back on its function.

I can report it works as intended. Having put thousands of kms in. Also driven long distances in Australian heat (temps over 104f) with both full and almost empty fuel tanks.

I intend to post some logs later too.

I have not told people to buy it but, I am positive about its function thus far and will keep the thread updated with any negative feedback if/when it arises.

Back to topic.

 

[Dumaurier7]

Since this thread speaks about the current aftermarket upgraded EKP options available to us, I see no reason why the ET3 cannot or should not be included so that persons can get all the information in one place, with that being said, below are pictures of both units side by side. The ET3 is a bit larger and heavier than the OEM and has the obvious cooling fan "upgrade". I did install it, but this did not go well, although it was as simple as cutting and re attaching four wires, I could not get the unit coded using Bimmer Tool, not sure if I have to use another more "sophisticated" scanner but this unit was listed as being compatible with the E89. During the process I also realized that the fuel system on the E89 is protected by a single 20A fuse which sorta contradicts the operating philosophy as this fuse will pop before the EKP reaches its advertised max limit of 40 Amps. Although I'm not sure if its 40 amps. per pump or combined (most likely the latter) it will require an increase in the fuses' amperage rating over the stock 20. I also plan to use the secondary pump output trigger to switch an external relay so as to not overload and possibly cause damage to any part of the OEM systems.

 

[Dumaurier7]

Finally got around to this install again, it was quick and easy this time around! For anyone doing this install, follow instructions and disconnect your battery! I took the short and “lazy” route which caused all the problems at first. Whilst fiddling with the wires I accidentally grounded the battery power and blew the 20A fuse., this is the reason I was having issues coding it to the car since it wasn’t powered on all that time which caused the car to throw couple codes too!
Anyway s alls well that ends well.