Fueling solutions

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Sergeant
Jul 27, 2017
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Am I right in thinking the VTT double barrell product is no longer available and PFS offer what looks like a knock off helix overdrive?

Is there any option to fuel the car for 750whp without port injection or meth?

I'd love a direct injection method but I've been waiting years for one that's reliable.

What is a 4x helix capable of?
 
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Torgus

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Nov 6, 2016
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The VTT DB has had lots of fitment and quality issues if you search. Wrong belts sent with customers having to mix and match until they find one that works, bad welds that cracked which means broken brackets and potentially other things, maxed out tensioners, you name it. But...that is pretty much par for the course with VTT. They are not known as a quality brand. At the end of the day you will likely not find out much about the double barrel as I don't think they sold a ton. So low volume and or problematic that Tony@VTT allowed Chris@PFS to sell a competing product the knock off helix overdrive for less than the VTT solution which basically means no more VTT DB or SB sales.

Yes the PFS POD is a rip off of Helix but it 'seems' to be built better or at least have less reported failures online.

I don't think I would want to run DI at 750whp on an n54 with the stock injectors. In fact you see a ton of people moving away from DI and going PI only with standalones for the very reason that the stock DI can be...problematic and no standalones control the stock DI injectors afaik.

That being said some people are successful running only DI.

PI is superior for a variety of reasons in my opinion but I am guessing you are set on DI and dislike PI and are willing to pay more for a DI system.
 

SLOWESTN54

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Go with the @PFS Pod, My car makes about 750wheel di only with about E63 in the tank. It may support A little more E content but not much more. In third gear I get down to about about 2000psi. Although fair warning @Torgus is correct I don't think you want to run DI only at this power level, you'll find as any injector wears you'll start to get timing corrections in that cylinder. Plus the noise of the overdrive is annoying.
 

Torgus

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Go with the @PFS Pod, My car makes about 750wheel di only with about E63 in the tank. It may support A little more E content but not much more. In third gear I get down to about about 2000psi. Although fair warning @Torgus is correct I don't think you want to run DI only at this power level, you'll find as any injector wears you'll start to get timing corrections in that cylinder. Plus the noise of the overdrive is annoying.

I knew you would find this thread ;)
 
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SLOWESTN54

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I knew you would find this thread ;)
Always do:)

Oh i almost forgot too. I believe my POD unit still leaks oil. I have a pool of oil under the hpfp, After my motor build everything was cleaned re sealed and put back in. That's the main reason I'm getting rid of my unit. And the startup noises are horrendous
 
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Torgus

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It will eventually run out of oil to leak!

You going PI I assume?
 

MoreBoost

Sergeant
Jul 27, 2017
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Thanks guys.

I did a (relatively) cheap and nasty port injection setup back in late 2016 where I simply ran 6 meth nozzles into the ports of my manifold.
Also kept the 2 nozzles in the charge pipe as a safety and to still see some cooling on the TMAP.
It's a JB4 controlling the meth. These days I run the back end flash and the JB4 for boost control and meth.

Well that system is pretty much just spray and the DME pulls fuel from the DI injectors when AFRs get too rich.
I'd love to have a system that is fully DME controlled which is why I was looking again at any HPFP solutions out there.
I'm not sure how well the combustion occurs in this type of system so a more accurate fuel delivery would be nice.
 

Dumaurier7

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May 19, 2020
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If you want proper fueling you should be running all three, DI, PI and H2O or MeOH injection, they all have their uses and benefits.
 

MoreBoost

Sergeant
Jul 27, 2017
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If you want proper fueling you should be running all three, DI, PI and H2O or MeOH injection, they all have their uses and benefits.

Why would I bother with port injection if DI could provide enough fuel bar keeping the valves clean?

My plan is to use alcohol based fuels with DI
 

MoreBoost

Sergeant
Jul 27, 2017
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Your confused. Where talking about the opposite side of the valve
Nope.
You are confused it looks like.

Unless I'm concerned with keeping the valves clean then I don't see a need for port injection etc if I'm using fuels with a high alcohol content.

On a stock (unbuilt engine) maybe the POD option is enough?
 

Dumaurier7

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May 19, 2020
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The pod is enough for up to 700 on pump but less on ethanol, if you would like to go past those numbers then PI is required, and yes, the added benefit is keeping the valves AND intake ports clean. If you look and many of the high-priced, high power super cars you'll see that they use both PI and DI, for the aforementioned benefits as well as "future proofing" the fuel system and making it easier to mod for even more output.
 
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MoreBoost

Sergeant
Jul 27, 2017
356
143
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335i
The pod is enough for up to 700 on pump but less on ethanol, if you would like to go past those numbers then PI is required, and yes, the added benefit is keeping the valves AND intake ports clean. If you look and many of the high-priced, high power super cars you'll see that they use both PI and DI, for the aforementioned benefits as well as "future proofing" the fuel system and making it easier to mod for even more output.
Yes.
I've seen even low cost cars using both injection technologies.
I'd be fine with port injection if I had a way to integrate it so it was fully DME controlled.
 

Dumaurier7

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May 19, 2020
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This has already been done with the ReFlex and ECUTEK, its only a matter of time before MHD figures it out!