Burger Tuning Oil Catch Can Long Term Review

matreyia

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This is a quick review of the Burger Tuning Oil Catch Can. Used for three years and going.

1. Does it work - does it retain oil? YES.
2. Will it prevent intake valves from getting dirty? NO.
3. Does it slow down intake valve gunk? I don't know...I did a walnut blast then checked six months later and the valves were already dirty enough to warrant another blast. So there you go.
4. Was it well built? Sure.
5. Does it require lots of maintenance? Not really, just empty after three months or more.
6. Would I get it again, would I get any oil catch can again? Yes.
7. How much oil is caught after three months? Enough to pour out of the can. So you can imagine it more so after six months.

Summary: Is it worth installing? I suppose so, but do not expect miracles. It's just a small step to help reduce the oil that would otherwise get sucked into the intake valves.

That is all.
 

Dreyo27

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I have that and the RB external PCV with plugged head ports. been on for 2+ years.

Within 500 miles of walnut blasting the valves already look dirty.
Within 5000 they already have buildup on the valves.
Within 22000 there is buildup on the cylynderhead walls by the intake valves.
 

matreyia

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I have that and the RB external PCV with plugged head ports. been on for 2+ years.

Within 500 miles of walnut blasting the valves already look dirty.
Within 5000 they already have buildup on the valves.
Within 22000 there is buildup on the cylynderhead walls by the intake valves.

I am not familiar with the plugged ports set up. I do have the PCV from RB though.
 

GotPwned

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Ive heard that the RB external PCV setup with a BMS catch can for high load and a Mishimoto catch can for low load will pretty much remove most of the carbon buildup if not all. Looking to do this but i want to see some people with results first.
 
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matreyia

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Ive heard that the RB external PCV setup with a BMS catch can for high load and a Mishimoto catch can for low load will pretty much remove most of the carbon buildup if not all. Looking to do this but i want to see some people with results first.
Won't that interfere with the air flow internally? One can is bad enough but two in between the intake valves???
 

Panzerfaust

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I am not familiar with the plugged ports set up. I do have the PCV from RB though.
When you say "PCV from RB", do you mean just the little valve or the full external kit where you put a catch can in the loop?

Lately the Facebook groups seem to think the upgraded PCV valve *is* the external PCV setup. I can't even tell you how many posts I've seen where people say they want to "go from the
RB external to a PCV delete so I can do a catch can" and then talk about screwing a cap over the PCV valve. In fact, I'd imagine Rob probably fields twice as many questions about his PCV options as he does about his turbos these days.
I have that and the RB external PCV with plugged head ports. been on for 2+ years.

Within 500 miles of walnut blasting the valves already look dirty.
Within 5000 they already have buildup on the valves.
Within 22000 there is buildup on the cylynderhead walls by the intake valves.
That's pretty disappointing to hear tbh. I, like many others, bought the external PCV hoping it'd decimate the need for walnut blasting. I don't run the BMS can because many have said it doesn't catch anything after the low side install, coupled with the fact that the high side dumps so far away from intake valves I doubt it contributes to any buildup.

What I did find interesting the other day is that one of the RB valves I have lying around from my pre-external days would actually leak a tiny bit once in a while if flat (how it would be installed in an N54) but sealed perfectly while vertical. Maybe that could be part of the reason we still get buildup?

I don't know anything about Toyota's engines, but if their PCV valve is normally mounted vertical it'd make sense. I seem to recall back when these first came out for our platform they were advertised as being able to hold like20-30psi+? The other options are either
A: I received a faulty one
B: the valve is a knockoff and doesn't seal like its supposed to.

All of this really has me re-thinking whether or not the Turner-ECS style of catch can/PCV setup could really be that bad. I've never seen anyone answer why completely plugging the low side and plumbing everything out the high side is a bad idea, other than Rob saying we'd have less vacuum at idle and the few reviews seem to be positive.
 

matreyia

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When you say "PCV from RB", do you mean just the little valve or the full external kit where you put a catch can in the loop?

Lately the Facebook groups seem to think the upgraded PCV valve *is* the external PCV setup. I can't even tell you how many posts I've seen where people say they want to "go from the
RB external to a PCV delete so I can do a catch can" and then talk about screwing a cap over the PCV valve. In fact, I'd imagine Rob probably fields twice as many questions about his PCV options as he does about his turbos these days.
That's pretty disappointing to hear tbh. I, like many others, bought the external PCV hoping it'd decimate the need for walnut blasting. I don't run the BMS can because many have said it doesn't catch anything after the low side install, coupled with the fact that the high side dumps so far away from intake valves I doubt it contributes to any buildup.

What I did find interesting the other day is that one of the RB valves I have lying around from my pre-external days would actually leak a tiny bit once in a while if flat (how it would be installed in an N54) but sealed perfectly while vertical. Maybe that could be part of the reason we still get buildup?

I don't know anything about Toyota's engines, but if their PCV valve is normally mounted vertical it'd make sense. I seem to recall back when these first came out for our platform they were advertised as being able to hold like20-30psi+? The other options are either
A: I received a faulty one
B: the valve is a knockoff and doesn't seal like its supposed to.

All of this really has me re-thinking whether or not the Turner-ECS style of catch can/PCV setup could really be that bad. I've never seen anyone answer why completely plugging the low side and plumbing everything out the high side is a bad idea, other than Rob saying we'd have less vacuum at idle and the few reviews seem to be positive.

There is a stock plastic PCV that is replaced by RB. That is the only thing I have. I do not know of any "kit" you speak of. I am unfamiliar with such a kit and don't even know how or what to do if it were given to me.
 

Panzerfaust

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There is a stock plastic PCV that is replaced by RB. That is the only thing I have. I do not know of any "kit" you speak of. I am unfamiliar with such a kit and don't even know how or what to do if it were given to me.
Okay, then the plugged head ports thing is a different setup than yours. RB sells two different pcv setups - an internal upgrade which is just a Toyota valve made to fit in the N54 (this is what you have), and a kit that externalizes the lowside PCV so that you can put a catch can there and catch any oil at vacuum, which is where most of your carbon build up comes from. That's what the person who said two cans meant, and that kit also allows you to plug the head ports.
 
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135Pats

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Our community *really* gets riled up over PCV discussion, there's been debate on best practices going back to 2012, if not earlier. No real consensus is ever reached, sofar as I can tell.

I just use the RB PCV line/can setup on the low side, and have the high side VTA thru a breather filter. Nothing scientific, but it seems to work fine so I'm not gonna overthink it.
 
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Rob09msport

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This is the only community that's so confused rb external setup is the only way we should be going. For most part if you are ideal vta candidate then you wouldnt be asking as you are a very high hp and advanced build.
 
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fmorelli

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What I don't understand is why one would need to Walnut blast with frequency, with an external high and low side PCV setup with a head plugged and assuming that everything is operating in a proper fashion?

Filippo
 
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matreyia

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What I don't understand is why one would need to Walnut blast with frequency, with an external high and low side PCV setup with a head plugged and assuming that everything is operating in a proper fashion?

Filippo
You got me.
 

Panzerfaust

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What I don't understand is why one would need to Walnut blast with frequency, with an external high and low side PCV setup with a head plugged and assuming that everything is operating in a proper fashion?

Filippo
That's my question too, and part of the reason I posted about my spare RB PCV sometimes leaking while horizontal but not when vertical. I blew into it for demonstration and even just my mouth made enough pressure to sneak past. If these valves weren't meant to be installed horizontally I wonder if they still let some blowby through at times. I need to do a quick Google of the 2jz's pcv system I guess.

Edit: from some google imaging, it definitely appears that the 2J has the valve mounted vertically, and then a 90 degree elbow is run off of it afterwards.

I seem to recall Tony talking about someone else's PCV valves leaking at a certain PSI vs his, but at the time took it as the competition that was par for the course especially after it was shown they were using the same internal valve. I'm wondering if Tony tested the other company's while it was horizontal and got the same results as I did because of it. @[email protected] , I don't think you were around back then but any chance Tony remembers how the testing was done? It'd be sadly hilarious if all of us have been running ultra-robust PCV valves in just the way that they'll leak for the past 7 years.
 
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Rob09msport

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That's my question too, and part of the reason I posted about my spare RB PCV sometimes leaking while horizontal but not when vertical. I blew into it for demonstration and even just my mouth made enough pressure to sneak past. If these valves weren't meant to be installed horizontally I wonder if they still let some blowby through at times. I need to do a quick Google of the 2jz's pcv system I guess.

Edit: from some google imaging, it definitely appears that the 2J has the valve mounted vertically, and then a 90 degree elbow is run off of it afterwards.

I seem to recall Tony talking about someone else's PCV valves leaking at a certain PSI vs his, but at the time took it as the competition that was par for the course especially after it was shown they were using the same internal valve. I'm wondering if Tony tested the other company's while it was horizontal and got the same results as I did because of it. @[email protected] , I don't think you were around back then but any chance Tony remembers how the testing was done? It'd be sadly hilarious if all of us have been running ultra-robust PCV valves in just the way that they'll leak for the past 7 years.
I am surprised rob hasn't responded cause if it was someone else's valve we would already have a white paper written up on here. Anyway sounds like this gives even more reason to go with rb external setup but everyone that purchased the internal valve if turns out improper application should get some discount or deal
 

Panzerfaust

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I am surprised rob hasn't responded cause if it was someone else's valve we would already have a white paper written up on here. Anyway sounds like this gives even more reason to go with rb external setup but everyone that purchased the internal valve if turns out improper application should get some discount or deal
Ha, you aren't wrong on the first part but I'll refrain from going further on that. Hopefully Chris will respond.

Unfortunately the external RB kit still uses the same valve though, it's just not capped like the regular one. I'm actually curious if the VTT in-line check valve would be a better solution - I might place an order and try it out. Unless @[email protected] wants to send me a free one for research! :tearsofjoy:
 

[email protected]

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I am surprised rob hasn't responded cause if it was someone else's valve we would already have a white paper written up on here.

Or perhaps there is a several more reasons such as:
1) The title is a BMS review.
2) The thread was written over a holiday weekend.
3) We either are taking time off work or are extremely busy upon return from said Holidays.
4) We do not see every discussion piece immediately, every time.
5) We literally just responded to the same question, to the same individual, a few days prior with a very thoughtful and lengthy explanation.

As for the valve positioning, it does not matter. PCV's can be mounted horizontal, vertical, remote, etc. If someone is getting "non-sealing" results from one position or another, they are clearly not utilizing it with their "blow test" as an engine would be using it under actual boost and vacuum conditions. It maybe worth mentioning that any fair amount of pressure, from around .25psi upward to 100psi, the valve will seal tight regardless. Gravity of course will help play a little part but if one is running their "seal tests" by blowing on the valve like it was a soap bubble wand, this could be the reason why they are getting some odd results. However once again this is not really applicable to an engine which typically varies from ~25in/hg Vacuum to ~25+psi Pressure.

Regarding the PCV valves drinking oil, this comes down to baffling in the Valve cover and is the entire premise of adding an OCC on the low side. If oil does make its way into the PCV valve (and it does, regardless if OEM or RB or any other; which are all positioned the same due to N54 design)- it can be caught with the external kit. There is no way around this and it is very effective every time if utilizing a recommended finely filtrated OCC.

If the valves are still getting mucked up there are several reasons, but as we have already outlined several reasons that could be in another post within the past week we will not take the time to do it again. A quick summary is that even with all bases covered buildup is going to occur over some amount of time for every N54 vehicle or any Internal combustion engine for that matter (regardless if Port Injected or not). The entire premise of OCC's is to mitigate buildup (ie. stop contaminates in their respective tracks), but we never expected to eliminate buildup entirely and indefinitely as it is just not realistic.

Rob
 
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[email protected]

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I don't think you were around back then but any chance Tony remembers how the testing was done? It'd be sadly hilarious if all of us have been running ultra-robust PCV valves in just the way that they'll leak for the past 7 years.

This was just Tony being Tony... we were not on BB at the time so he ran around there for years literally making stuff up to garner sales and supporters. Really he had just copied the RB valve setup, then marked it up $5, and wanted to justify why their company had the best valve even though it was an exact replica (he'd ordered 20 of our PCV units just beforehand) at the time. Got to love how easy it is to twist up those on the internet, eh?

We eventually joined BB and made this hoax (and several others) extremely clear, and that thread in particular is still there for review on BB. Chris (then only a VTT Leg Humper) actually was a part of that thread, commenting as SCGT; still defended him prior to even being on any payroll. (Google "RB PCV Valve deceptive" and look for the BB thread if you wish).
 
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Rob09msport

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You gave 5 responses really 2 cause 4 were just the same worded differently to a joke and I recommended your external setup at same time. I do belive if the valve doesn't properly seal in our application then that needs to be addressed. I was corrected by panzer cause I thought the external kit got rid of that issue cause I remember reading just throw out your old rb valve in a DIY.

Anyway I too am curious about vtt setup. I have a BMS high side so I would think rb more economical for me but really it's more of rob has done great job explaining the pcv system and how his kit works. The vtt kit seems great I just am more lost on how I should approach since it is set up for multiple options but also makes it confusing on what is best for most builds and what exactly to order.
Rob I think your great designer and have tons of knowledge just you have habit of beating dead horse and going to far too make sure everyone knows your right just give the facts let people learn and it will prob work out better the drama hurts all involved and makes them look petty

Edited
I also want say I do get it im sure it's extremely frustrating but trust me most of us see and know who copies who and who does right by customers and anyone that followed this platform will see that but unfortunately badmouthing another company even when accurate usually hurts both parties involved I learned that a long time ago whe I'm in that situation I will just educate and leave my personal opinions and feelings out and let customer connect dots.
 
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[email protected]

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Rob I think your great designer and have tons of knowledge just you have habit of beating dead horse and going to far too make sure everyone knows your right just give the facts let people learn and it will prob work out better the drama hurts all involved and makes them look petty

Cool thanks for the advice bubs.
 
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