TTFS/XDI late e-series single HPFP upgrade

[Xer0449]

Wanted to start a new thread on this so I'd stop hijacking @VACust 's.

Preface:
My late e-series N55 E82 has been in great health and well maintained. It's got full bolt-ons + PS2 and all the goodies. I live in CA where the 91 is hamburger grease, and I really wanted to wake this nice turbo up.


Goodies:
64K mi odo
DCT
Pure Stage 2 turbo + GFB DV + Pure Inlet
VRSF turbo outlet
VRSF 7" intercooler
BMS intake
VRSF chargepipe
VRSF catless downpipe
Performance Exhaust
N20 TMAP
Stage2 Bucketless LPFP
Mfactory LSD
TTFS HPFP

The HPFP between the early e-series and late e-series differ. The late e-series build date post 03/12 come with the F-style piston pump, whereas the early e-series come with the rotary style N54 style pump (which flows much, much better).

Here's where we stood prior to the XDI pump:
https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/91-v14-dynojet?log=0&data=4-10-18-19-21-26-27-28-29-30-31-39-41-43-45

Pretty impressive for 91ACN, IMHO.

Wedge and I tried E30 (spoiler alert: it didn't go well)

https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/e30-v4-new-filterfprhpfp?log=0&data=4-16-17-18-21-22-23-24-25-26-30

I kept debating going between meth and PI (both of which I'd expect to be incompatible with MOTIV's upcoming flex-fuel kit for N55), until I had heard that somebody was coming out with a 'factory-like' solution, which was nice since the TTFS dual-pump solution was just too expensive to justify.

@TuningTechFS and http://www.xtreme-di.com/ teamed up to provide the first F-series style HPFP upgrade, available here: http://tuningtechfs.com/ttfs-n55-high-performance-fuel-pump-single-pump/

Here's what arrived:

There's been a lot of back and forth between myself, @WedgePerformance , MHD and Frank @TuningTechFS.
Frank needed me to pull my flash using their provided Frieling cable (BG cable would not work) and the Frieling software. I sent it over, and after (more) back and forth, we eventually got what we needed which was my flash + the offsets to power their HPFP, since it runs off a different frequency.

tl;dr: If you install this pump without a map prepared, the car will not start.

Wedge got what he needed, defined the XDF's and off we went: A few long cranks the car fired right up.

Unfortunately I didn't install it myself, however my tech/bmw-ninja let me know that he had to alter the underside of my intake manifold, and slightly bend the provided fuel line for everything to fit.

Between TTFS needing my ROM, and parts 'almost' fitting, I have a hunch that I may be the first late e-series to have this pump installed - but somebody chime in if I'm mistaken.

Decided to take a log on my current 91acn map:

https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/xdi-first-test?log=0&data=4-21-41-42-43-44-45-46

If you know how bad this fuel is out here, this is a nice conservative tune.

Ken sent back a revision with 5% WGDC increase, but I wanted to try some corn ASAP

E30 basemap:
https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/xdi-e...-19-21-26-27-28-29-30-31-39-41-42-43-44-45-46

Car feels fantastic! HUGE improvement.

Ken tells me he's working on getting the boost curve nice and smooth before we start throwing timing and more ethanol at it. We're not sure exactly where this pumps limits are, so taking things very slowly.

TTFS claims that this pump can support 600whp pure stage 2 on full E-85 with proper LPFP, so let's see...

7/16:
(E50) This was a rough one...
https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/xdi-e30-v3-breaking?log=1&data=4-10-18-19-21-26-27-28-29-30-31-39

It looks like rail pressure is dipping causing leaning out + misfires.
Reaching out to TTFS to see what's up...

7/19:
(E40) Car freaking RIPS!I don't think the car has ever been happier.

Heeded the advice of @houtan and @Newguy123 (thanks guys!) regarding the phantom misfires on the stock DCT flywheel after 22psi. Asked Ken for a map that had boost ceiling of 19psi and some timing.

Decided to stay on the fuel-it stg2 bucketless for right now and see if we could remediate what appears to be a cavitation issue. I only now remembered that even with the aftermarket LPFP and HPFP, I'm still running the stock fuel line from the tank (oops...). Fuel-it AN6 on the way...

No doubt about it, the @TuningTechFS HPFP solution works. These should be an add-on for any late e-series or F-series N55 PS2 purchase right on PURE's site, IMO.

https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/e40-v41-timing?log=2&data=4-10-18-19-21-26-27-28-29-30-31-41-43-45

I have 3 more maps to test, each stepping up the timing by a degree. Will post up logs.

8/16
Went down to EAS in Anaheim to dyno the car. It was a very hot day - I'll head back down after a few more revisions and when it's not 100 degrees out.
Side note: The car kept shifting on it's own when on the rollers. Anyone seen that before?
This was on E40; the gross looking lines are from earlier in the year on 91.

Currently running E50 daily. Don't mind the taper, we're just trying to get this damn phantom knock thing avoided consistently.
https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/v7-e50?log=0&data=4-10-18-19-21-26-27-28-29-30-31-39

10/5
Still running E50, and it seems like we got the boost taper nice and proper to avoid the dreaded misfire. I've done maybe 10 WOT pulls in varying degrees of ambient temp and no misfires
This car is a fcking rocket, and done being tuned Huge thanks to @WedgePerformance
https://datazap.me/u/xer0-449/e40-p...-10-12-21-26-27-28-29-30-31-40-41-42-43-44-45

 

[WedgePerformance]

I want to throw up looking at your pump map. I should pull about 5 deg out of it so it's really slow. LOL

 

[doublespaces]

Would love to see some photos of it installed

 

[Xer0449]

Don't have any, unfortunately; aside from what's publicly available.

 

[DrRobert]

I wonder if this is the fueling system upgrade I have been waiting for. I have early N55 engine in my 2011 E90 with PS2, FMIC, CP, HFC, stock fueling and custom Wedge tune. I live in CA and have the same junk 91 pump gas as OP. E25 is the highest E% that Ken was able to tune for without my fuel pumps crapping out. He said he might be able to get me up to E30 with LPFP upgrade but probably no higher with the stock HPFP. I'm waiting for the Motiv N55 flex fuel and plan to upgrade LPFP at that time, still unsure what to do about the HPFP. The $5K TTFS HPFP is too expensive. Ken what do you think of this HPFP replacement?

 

[doublespaces]

I wonder if this is the fueling system upgrade I have been waiting for. I have early N55 engine in my 2011 E90 with PS2, FMIC, CP, HFC, stock fueling and custom Wedge tune. I live in CA and have the same junk 91 pump gas as OP. E25 is the highest E% that Ken was able to tune for without my fuel pumps crapping out. He said he might be able to get me up to E30 with LPFP upgrade but probably no higher with the stock HPFP. I'm waiting for the Motiv N55 flex fuel and plan to upgrade LPFP at that time, still unsure what to do about the HPFP. The $5K TTFS HPFP is too expensive. Ken what do you think of this HPFP replacement?

I thought the early n55 used the n54 style rotary pumps? In that case you can use the shotgun.

 

[VACust]

I thought the early n55 used the n54 style rotary pumps? In that case you can use the shotgun.

You are correct. 03/2012 and newer are the style in this post.

 

[Xer0449]

You are correct. 03/2012 and newer are the style in this post.

Yup, which is why @DrRobert was able to run any ethanol at all

I want to throw up looking at your pump map. I should pull about 5 deg out of it so it's really slow. LOL

No worries, Ken - the car is surprisingly fast on pump

 

[Xer0449]

Updated

 

[DrRobert]

I thought the early n55 used the n54 style rotary pumps? In that case you can use the shotgun.

Yes, shotgun is compatible with my 2011 N55. But a double barrel kit with all the options is only $150 less than this new pump, which seems like a simpler solution if it works as advertised.

 

[VACust]

Yes, shotgun is compatible with my 2011 N55. But a double barrel kit with all the options is only $150 less than this new pump, which seems like a simpler solution if it works as advertised.

I talked to Frank a little bit about it and he thought this setup might work with a newer vacuum pump. He still needed to dig around with the older DME to see if it could be retrofit. From what I gathered he saw the fuel system hardware change wouldn’t be an issue but just programming/tuning and maybe wiring. Frank would have to answer this for sure as I had the newer HPFP and was curious about the N54 style HPFP swap. I never asked about camshaft or anything alas that may be needed. @TuningTechFS

 

[Xer0449]

I just got off the phone with Frank. After a ton of technical detail about stuff that's way over my head, he believes that ditching the stage 2 bucketless and going back to the stocker LPFP should alleviate the supply issue. I need to put an ECA in anyway.

 

[houtan]

Your rail pressure is above 2k in that last log. That should be fine. Your boost seems way too high for the stock dct flywheel, which is probably why you are getting misfires. Drop the boost to 19 and below.

Having said that, per the diy tuning thread, SBRACH has showed some promise on boosting more than 19 pounds on the stock dct flywheel with the work he has been doing.

 

[houtan]

I wonder if this is the fueling system upgrade I have been waiting for. I have early N55 engine in my 2011 E90 with PS2, FMIC, CP, HFC, stock fueling and custom Wedge tune. I live in CA and have the same junk 91 pump gas as OP. E25 is the highest E% that Ken was able to tune for without my fuel pumps crapping out. He said he might be able to get me up to E30 with LPFP upgrade but probably no higher with the stock HPFP. I'm waiting for the Motiv N55 flex fuel and plan to upgrade LPFP at that time, still unsure what to do about the HPFP. The $5K TTFS HPFP is too expensive. Ken what do you think of this HPFP replacement?

I don’t think this pump will outflow your stock pump by much. Look at the more recent posts in the diy tuning thread, there are some new discoveries allowing e50 and 20+ psi, stock early 2012 and 2011 hpfp.

 

[Xer0449]

@houtan are you suggesting that i'm not actually having a fuel supply issue, but i'm misfiring from the stock DMFW? I hadn't thought of that...

Edit: I'm annoyed I hadn't thought of this - it's not like it hasn't been documented. Nice catch.

 

[houtan]

Yup. Anything over 19psi and it will happen. Log will look good but you will get misfires.

 

[Xer0449]

Yup. Anything over 19psi and it will happen. Log will look good but you will get misfires.

Going to give it a try before swapping the stock LP back in. Dial boost back to 19psi and add some timing on e50 and see how she holds.

 

[Jake@MHD]

After a ton of technical detail about stuff that's way over my head, he believes that ditching the stage 2 bucketless and going back to the stocker LPFP should alleviate the supply issue.

This seems ass-backwards.

 

[Xer0449]

This seems ass-backwards.

I won't speak for @TuningTechFS , but he mentioned something to do with the amperage that the pumps are designed to run at. Maybe he can chime in, here.

 

[Jake@MHD]

LPFP amperage should have nothing to do with HPFP amperage. HPFP, yes, is tuned on an expected current vs. fuel flow basis.