Issues with waterpump and/or cooling

[Snowman]

My car is a 335 N54 2007 with about 95000miles on it, where all were done bone stock.
I got it just about 1,5months ago and until today ive spent more time wrenching with it, rather than actually driving..

So moving on to the problem.
About 3weeks ago i got a high temperature warning when doing some heavy pulls, first a yellow one and seconds later red one.
I then basicly cruised to a stop, checked the engine bay just to see that there had been coolant splashed under the hood.
I checked for codes and had some for the water pump, the car was still on the stock one and i was aware that it would require changing soon.
I then fired up the car and drove it home as gently sa possible while monitoring temperatures through Jb4, they were fine at normal temperature during the short drive back home.

However moving forward to like 1week ago, i then replaced the WP to a new VDO/Continental pump.
I did the bleeding procedure 2 times and filled up the coolant and also idled the car to get it hot and see that everything worked before i took it for a drive.
On the first drive i kept my eyes on the temperatures and after about 10-15min of driving the temperatures suddenly skyrocketed.
I pulled over and killed the car, then when it had cooled down i tried to limp it closer to the garage but the temperatures shot from 95c to 120c in matter of 1-2minutes.
Once back at the garage i read the codes and got these:

I then googled my ass off and then this morning i replaced the thermostat.
That seems to have erased the error codes, however now i have the same issue but with a diffrent shape..
Now i knew i had issues with the Wp so ive been constantly checking for codes, but i can bleed the system without problems and also idle the car without it throwing codes.
However when i went for a short drive i only made it like 1-2km before it threw codes at me again..
This time the codes were diffrent compared to first time..

Ive checked the wires/harness for damage.
There are no damage to be found to the WP harness.
I found a minor damage to one of the thermostat wires but it was just to one of them and it had also been covered up.
What else should i look into?
The pump is brand new, so i really hope that it has not failed or that i received a faulty one..

All advice is appreciated since i really want to drive this thing now..

 

[Jeffman]

Flushing the coolant system several times with distilled water and Prestone coolant flush may be required, especially if it was never done. I prescribe by Mike Miller’s “Old School Maintenance” by flushing the coolant system every two years or 30K miles.
Good luck!

 

[Snowman]

Flushing the coolant system several times with distilled water and Prestone coolant flush may be required, especially if it was never done. I prescribe by Mike Miller’s “Old School Maintenance” by flushing the coolant system every two years or 30K miles.
Good luck!

Well i have drained the system twice since i first replaced the wp and then today the thermostat.
Also i dont really understand how that could cause 2e81 and 2e82?
I mean the car was working from the begining, before i replaced the wp, even though it didnt like to be pushed.
Now i cant drive the car at all.

 

[Jeffman]

Gotcha. We assume your system has been completely flushed and there is no blockage anywhere; so therefor it’s an electrical or component problem.

Not sure if this will help, but here’s what I have listed in my error code cheat sheet:
2E81 electrical cooling pump:, speed deviation
2E82 electrical cooling pump: switch off
2E83 electrical cooling pump, low-power mode
2E84 electrical cooling pump, communication
2E85 electrical cooling pump, communication

If I had this problem I would connect the car to INPA or another diagnostics computer and check the performance and communication of the electric water pump.

A visual check of the DME box may also be a good idea to make sure there wasn’t any water damage.

When the original water pump failed and you saw the coolant in the engine bay it’s possible something popped and caused coolant to get into the connectors or wiring. Check, clean and dry all connectors.

Best of luck
Edit. Water pump.

 

[Snowman]

Gotcha. We assume your system has been completely flushed and there is no blockage anywhere; so therefor it’s an electrical or component problem.

Not sure if this will help, but here’s what I have listed in my error code cheat sheet:
2E81 electrical cooling pump:, speed deviation
2E82 electrical cooling pump: switch off
2E83 electrical cooling pump, low-power mode
2E84 electrical cooling pump, communication
2E85 electrical cooling pump, communication

If I had this problem I would connect the car to INPA or another diagnostics computer and check the performance and communication of the electric fuel pump.

A visual check of the DME box may also be a good idea to make sure there wasn’t any water damage.

When the original water pump failed and you saw the coolant in the engine bay it’s possible something popped and caused coolant to get into the connectors or wiring. Check, clean and dry all connectors.

Best of luck!

First i assume you ment "electric water pump" and not fuel pump?

If there would be a blockage anywhere, then it would have to be small and just existing from time to time, since it was not there at first today and then suddenly appeared and then disappeared again.

Yes thank you, i already tried googling all of them and 2e83 could have been a faulty thermostat, which is why i replaced it.
Then i got 2 new codes to replace the previous ones..

Yeah i will loan INPA from a friend on monday, hopefully i will be able to see something..

Yes that is a possibility, however the car did run just fine if you drove it carefully. So after it initally cooled down i were able to drive it for another 50km on 2 separate events, without any issues.
Then i replaced the wp and everything went downwards..
The sockets and harness for the wp looks good, no corrosion.

I will doublecheck the DME area and also the actual DME tomorrow.

Thanks!

 

[NoQuarter]

Did you replace the thermostat? (skimmed the thread. Didn't see it)

 

[Snowman]

Did you replace the thermostat? (skimmed the thread. Didn't see it)

Yes the thermostat was replaced in between the 2 pictures of error codes. The second image is after the replacemenent.

 

[rac]

Electrical problem either with harness or pump itself. These pumps have failed almost right out of the box to others so while unfortunate you can't rule it out. I gave my parts supplier a heads up about how unreliable these guys are so he said keep the receipt and bring it straight back if it fails prematurely. My first pump failed electrically and the second cracked the housing. 2 over 10 years ain't bad for BMW water pumps.... Lol.

 

[Snowman]

Electrical problem either with harness or pump itself. These pumps have failed almost right out of the box to others so while unfortunate you can't rule it out. I gave my parts supplier a heads up about how unreliable these guys are so he said keep the receipt and bring it straight back if it fails prematurely. My first pump failed electrically and the second cracked the housing. 2 over 10 years ain't bad for BMW water pumps.... Lol.

Yeah ive read horror stories about pumps failing and the codes are indeed poiniting at it..
I will borrow a computer with INPA in the afternoon and test the pump.

If it performs well all the way up to 100% and the reading also is correct, would that be a safe indication that the pump is OK?
In the opposite, if it fails lets say above 50%, would it be safe to say that the wp is bad?

Once thing that crossed my mind is that ive been pulling the negative connector for the battery quite alot since ive been wrenching quite alot with it.
Also ive been flashing the car back/forth which i then have been charging the battery meanwhile, but directly to the battery and not through the "correct" connectors for charging.
Could the above have caused something?

Also ive been trying to find some information on how the bleeding procedure should work.
Because when i start it the wp runs for like 10-15s and then turns off for some seconds, then starts again, then this is repeated a number of times. Also the total time the bleeding takes is about 10minutes 30s and not 12minutes as everyone states. Could this be an indication that i have another problem or is it normal?

 

[rac]

I will borrow a computer with INPA in the afternoon and test the pump.

If it performs well all the way up to 100% and the reading also is correct, would that be a safe indication that the pump is OK?
In the opposite, if it fails lets say above 50%, would it be safe to say that the wp is bad?

From memory it was obvious when mine failed electrically, as in it didn't function at all. If that helps you any.
The fact that yours does go through the priming routine makes me wonder.

Also ive been trying to find some information on how the bleeding procedure should work.
Because when i start it the wp runs for like 10-15s and then turns off for some seconds, then starts again, then this is repeated a number of times. Also the total time the bleeding takes is about 10minutes 30s and not 12minutes as everyone states. Could this be an indication that i have another problem or is it normal?

What you describe sounds normal, did it a few times last week. Did not time it but the start-stop cycle is expected. I don't feel like it went 12 minutes long either but I could be wrong.

 

[Snowman]

Yesterday something strange happened...
I first checked the fluid level and it was on max.
I then ran the bleeding procedure but through inpa this time.
When it finished I could refill about 200ml of fluid and I then let the car heat up.
Once it was up to temperature I took it for a drive while Monitoring the wp operation through inpa.
I drove it for like 10minutes, in addition to that it was already warm when I started the drive, without any issues.
Could 2e81 be caused by a small amount of air in the system?
Or was I just lucky that the intermittent fault did not happen on my short drive?

 

[Snowman]

From memory it was obvious when mine failed electrically, as in it didn't function at all. If that helps you any.
The fact that yours does go through the priming routine makes me wonder.



What you describe sounds normal, did it a few times last week. Did not time it but the start-stop cycle is expected. I don't feel like it went 12 minutes long either but I could be wrong.

Yeah my pump operation was spot on during the bleeding in INPA, except that when it was commanded 95% PWM operation the feedback were only 89%, but i guess that is also such a small diffrence and it seeems to be fully functioning during the rest of the bleeding procedure.

 

[tony@codewerx]

Change the water pump. It’s faulty.

Yes i read it’s New. But water pump installs - it was never to be that complex - air locks or pockets etc does not cause bsd issues.

And yes - seen new ones go in and end up with bsd problems.

Just get a replacement and reinstall.

 

[Snowman]

Change the water pump. It’s faulty.

Yes i read it’s New. But water pump installs - it was never to be that complex - air locks or pockets etc does not cause bsd issues.

And yes - seen new ones go in and end up with bsd problems.

Just get a replacement and reinstall.

Well the issue is now that i drove the car about 30miles and it works perfect.
BSD codes went away after the thermostat replacement as i wrote in the first post.
There is not a chance that the dealer that i bought the pump from would accept a return now, since the pump does indeed seem to be working at the time..
Today im not to happy about spending an additional 350-400euro on another wp either..

One thing that i corrected yesterday was a small damage to one of the wires for the thermostat. The insulation had been damaged and someone had wrapped it with tape. However only one of the two wires had insulation that had been stripped, so it could not get in contact with the other one and there were no ground close by that it could contact. So it should not have been caused by this, even if it got in contact with ground i dont see how it could have caused WP problems..

 

[Snowman]

Okay so it happend again after pushing the car some..
It seems like something is failing due to temperatures..
First code was 2e81 and then also 2e82 came along after clearing codes and trying to limp it back to the garage while watching temperatures..

What controls the wp?
Is it possible that the thing that is controlling it, fails due to overheating?
I have a custom bef which most likely runs the wp harder than the stock mapping..

 

[Jeffman]

There should be some kind of warranty on the water pump you just bought. Print out this post to show the dealer what you’ve been through and ask them to give you another pump.

 

[Rcboosted2007]

Okay so it happend again after pushing the car some..
It seems like something is failing due to temperatures..
First code was 2e81 and then also 2e82 came along after clearing codes and trying to limp it back to the garage while watching temperatures..

What controls the wp?
Is it possible that the thing that is controlling it, fails due to overheating?
I have a custom bef which most likely runs the wp harder than the stock mapping..

Okay this is What happened to me. After hard acceleration the cable in the trunk( which powers the water pump) that connects to the battery. Came loose causing intermittent failures.It finally blew the fuse one day( on top of the battery) not the fuse in the engine bay. Maybe check your cable

 

[Rcboosted2007]

 

[Snowman]

There should be some kind of warranty on the water pump you just bought. Print out this post to show the dealer what you’ve been through and ask them to give you another pump.

Yes i do have a warranty on it.
However the company is not usually easy to deal with when it comes to warranty requests..
Which is why i want to be 100% sure that the wp is defective before contacting them.

Okay this is What happened to me. After hard acceleration the cable in the trunk( which powers the water pump) that connects to the battery. Came loose causing intermittent failures.It finally blew the fuse one day( on top of the battery) not the fuse in the engine bay. Maybe check your cable

Which one of all the wires connected to the battery came loose?
I will double check this.

 

[tony@codewerx]

Okay so it happend again after pushing the car some..


What controls the wp?
Is it possible that the thing that is controlling it, fails due to overheating?
I have a custom bef which most likely runs the wp harder than the stock mapping..

The thermostat has a big say and the DME too ...